What did you do to your Yamaha FZ-07 today?

[atwater]

Put all the stock parts back on, time to sell the fz07 

[Civiltechyyc]

1 hour ago, atwater said:

Put all the stock parts back on, time to sell the fz07 

Hopefully for a new bike...??

[atwater]

5 hours ago, Civiltechyyc said:

Hopefully for a new bike...??

Yeah switching to an r6 for my track bike. 
 

[Qays]

Did the R&G frame sliders, Power Commander 5, DNA Filter with Lid, and Akrapovic System. Together its such a sweet combo. No pops whatsoever on decelerations just like it should be 

[JayMT07]

Installed the HealTech QS last week. Weather has been terrible and I’ve only had the chance to take it out once but it sure added some fun. A bit more tweaking is needed, though. 
 

 

[FZWes]

I had  the Harlot on a Dyno today. No surprise the results were 72 hp, it was a free run at a dealer here in town. I regards to performance I've had the PC 5 tuned from Power Commander, removed the snorkel, and installed a full Yoshi exhaust. With those mods it basically gave me nothing as far a power goes, I didn't get a torque reading because again the run was free.

Some riders have sent their ECU of to get tuned by 2WDW now if I remember correctly I corresponded with these folks and they said the flash of your stock ECU would yield a gain of 2-3 hp, for $300.+ forgetaboutit. (if someone was told different about the hp gain feel free to share that 411.) Also there are of course several takes on air box mod in regard  to what happens to the air once it's drawn into the box. If  you remove the top of the box cover the air doesn't flow properly as it scatters all over the inside of the box instead of being drawn in clean. As for Vel stacks I have read that here in no discernable gains made there either. Upon hearing that it seemed the only positive is aesthetics.

All this info is what I've gleaned off line, I'm not a wrench myself and have about zero knowledge of these bikes so if something I said here is inaccurate keep that in mind. 

[Devilman]

Just installed my Healtech Quick Shift last night. The factory settings were not that good but I found a post from Otorongo with his settings. It now shifts buttery smooth. I also learned how to turn off the downshift feature because it is rough because it can't rev match the engine. Did that and the bike runs and shifts great.

[Civiltechyyc]

8 hours ago, Devilman said:

Just installed my Healtech Quick Shift last night. The factory settings were not that good but I found a post from Otorongo with his settings. It now shifts buttery smooth. I also learned how to turn off the downshift feature because it is rough because it can't rev match the engine. Did that and the bike runs and shifts great.

Over cost vs. Benefit... worth it?

[Joaoduarte]

On 4/23/2021 at 8:25 AM, FZWes said:

I had  the Harlot on a Dyno today. No surprise the results were 72 hp, it was a free run at a dealer here in town. I regards to performance I've had the PC 5 tuned from Power Commander, removed the snorkel, and installed a full Yoshi exhaust. With those mods it basically gave me nothing as far a power goes, I didn't get a torque reading because again the run was free.

Some riders have sent their ECU of to get tuned by 2WDW now if I remember correctly I corresponded with these folks and they said the flash of your stock ECU would yield a gain of 2-3 hp, for $300.+ forgetaboutit. (if someone was told different about the hp gain feel free to share that 411.) Also there are of course several takes on air box mod in regard  to what happens to the air once it's drawn into the box. If  you remove the top of the box cover the air doesn't flow properly as it scatters all over the inside of the box instead of being drawn in clean. As for Vel stacks I have read that here in no discernable gains made there either. Upon hearing that it seemed the only positive is aesthetics.

All this info is what I've gleaned off line, I'm not a wrench myself and have about zero knowledge of these bikes so if something I said here is inaccurate keep that in mind. 

You did a run before the power commander + exhaust + filter?  Otherwise you dont know stock numbers

[FZWes]

I must confess, I do not do a run prior. I"m the second owner, when I bought the bike the PC 5 was installed but not active. I put the Yami R77 full system, yanked the snorkel, and called Dyno and did a generic download from them all in the same day. Any input you have is appreciated.

[Joaoduarte]

8 hours ago, FZWes said:

I must confess, I do not do a run prior. I"m the second owner, when I bought the bike the PC 5 was installed but not active. I put the Yami R77 full system, yanked the snorkel, and called Dyno and did a generic download from them all in the same day. Any input you have is appreciated.

Ive a map switch, and i just for testing placed on map 1 the tuned map and on map 2 stock zeroed map, like you i was thinking that difference would be zero, but no it changes a lot the bike.

[Devilman]

On 5/1/2021 at 12:09 AM, Civiltechyyc said:

Over cost vs. Benefit... worth it?

I like it. It was worth it to me. Especially getting on the highway from the on ramp. LOL. I  clutchless shift before I bought it but now so it just made it more fun. Does it completely change the bike? No, but it fun and the Biden bucks payed for it. LOL

[FZWes]

Alright while I have your attention, here's a question on fuel. What octane do you use in your bike? Here in Vegas we have choices of 87,89,91. Since I bought the bike I've used 87 with no issues. However, I have read in forums and I believe in a downloadable owners manual 91 is required, preferred whichever you call it.  

Thanks FZWes

[D.A.]

13 hours ago, FZWes said:

What octane do you use in your bike? ... Since I bought the bike I've used 87 with no issues. However, I have read in forums and I believe in a downloadable owners manual 91 is required...

The short answer is the bike requires plain old regular Unleaded Gasoline (unless you’ve had the timing advanced via ECU flashing; in that scenario Premium Unleaded is needed to avoid preignition [a.k.a. knock]).

The confusion surrounding fuel can be traced to a couple of issues:

1) The word octane is used in multiple ways.

For instance, there is pump octane number, research octane number (abbreviated as RON) and motor octane number (MON). The numbers, while related, are not equivalent. In the USA, the pump octane number is what you see on a gas pump. It is calculated by averaging RON and MON using the formula (R+M)/2. For example, the sum of 91 RON + 81 MON divided by 2 results in 86 pump octane.

Download the owners manuals for any year US-model of the FZ/MT-07 and you will discover they all specify use of Regular Unleaded Gasoline with minimum 86 pump octane or 91 research octane. 

2) There are regional differences in the way the word Premium is used.

In the EU/UK, gas pumps display the RON rather than Pump Octane Number. And the manuals for all model years of the European MT-07 specify Premium Unleaded Gasoline with 95 RON, which makes it sound like the EU model requires a higher octane than the US model. However, that is not the case. All versions of the FZ/MT-07, regardless of country, have the same compression ratio (11.5 to 1), and therefore require the same fuel. The problem in this instance is that UK/EU RON numbers are not equivalent to US RON numbers. 

Adding to the confusion is the way fuels are marketed in different countries. Gas stations in the USA sell Regular Unleaded (generally 87 pump octane), Unleaded Plus (89 pump octane) and Premium Unleaded (91 pump octane). By contrast, the last time I rented a car in the UK, the 3 grades of petrol available at gas stations were Premium Unleaded (95 RON), Super Unleaded (97 RON) and brand-specific hyper-Premiums (like 99 RON V-Power at Shell stations). They don’t sell a product called “Regular” Unleaded fuel in the UK. Instead, their regular petrol is marketed as “Premium.”

The UK's Premium equates to Regular in the USA, their Super Unleaded is roughly equivalent to Premium in the USA, and their V-Power is almost like the racing fuel you can only buy at tracks in the USA. To the best of my knowledge, the UK has no product equivalent to the USA's Unleaded Plus but I guess that makes sense since relatively few vehicles use it.

Bottom line is that 86 pump octane (USA), 91 RON (USA) and 95 RON (UK) are effectively the same grade of gasoline.

Armed with this data it is easy to understand how, in the age of the internet, a motorcyclist could download a foreign market version of an owners manual, ingest erroneous specifications and spread disinformation to the masses.

Here’s a screen grab from a US-model MT-07 owners manual (the specs for all US-model FZ/MT-07s from 2015-2021 are identical):

And a screen grab from the owners manual for the EU model (it’s the same for all model years):

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by D.A.

[FZWes]

Thank you D.A. for non exhaustive wealth of information. 

[FZWes]

 I deleted that post I made due to the fact it wasn't accurate information.

Edited May 4, 2021 by FZWes
Not accurate information.

[D.A.]

9 hours ago, FZWes said:

... I copied and pasted this from an on line manual ...

Nice!

However, to clarify for others reading this (and to avoid propagating any confusion regarding fuel grades), the section copied and pasted in @FZWes’s post is from the EU version of the MT-07 owners manual, or more specifically, the UK version. 

Meaning, yes, in the UK, MT-07 riders should use Premium fuel that has a research octane number of 95 or higher.

American riders should use the same fuel but need to understand that what is marketed as Premium/RON 95 in the UK is similar to what is sold as Regular Unleaded/86 Pump Octane/91 RON in the USA. 

It’s one basic grade of gasoline with 5 different nicknames. 

Edited May 3, 2021 by D.A.

[D.A.]

9 hours ago, FZWes said:

... You did mention having an ECU flash which I shouldn't confuse that with having the PC 5 installed ...

True, my understanding is the Power Commander 5 cannot advance spark timing by itself but DynoJet's Ignition Module can handle that task. Do you have one of those installed as well?

Edited May 3, 2021 by D.A.

[stickshift]

1 hour ago, D.A. said:

True, my understanding is the Power Commander 5 cannot advance spark timing by itself but DynoJet's Ignition Module can handle that task. Do you have one of those installed as well?

The PCV for MT07 does have the capability to modify ignition timing (no Ignition Module necessary).

[FZWes]

I do not, just the PC V.

[Devilman]

I sent my ECM to have it flashed by 2 Wheel DynoWorks last year and they advanced it so I could use High octane fuel. Made it a little bit more get-up and go and smoothed the bike out. They have great customer support and will not B.S. you when you have questions for like a drop in filter (K&N and the like), he said nope unless you change out the airbox. I had it flashed because I want to set it and forget it and not have a bunch of extra wires and connectors. 

[D.A.]

7 hours ago, Devilman said:

I sent my ECM to have it flashed by 2 Wheel DynoWorks last year and they advanced it so I could use High octane fuel. ...

That is an intriguing comment! 

Are you saying you WANTED to be able to use high octane gasoline and that’s one of the reasons you had your ECU flashed? If so, can you explain why?

I’m confused because while advancing spark timing at certain RPMs can be advantageous, having to pay more for high octane fuel seems like a clear disadvantage. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by D.A.

[FZWes]

Hello, well last night I did an oil and filter change and replaced the coolant. Sunday we'll adjust the chain tension, flush the brake system and replace with fresh fluid. Other than getting the intake synced to ensure proper vacuum pressure that is about all I see for the 8000 mile service.

One more thing, sometimes the bike won't upshift properly. I can usually feel that it didn't engage the next higher gear when shifting. I was hoping that when i changed the oil it may have helped but it didn't. The 4000 mi oil change I used Mobile 1 this time around I used Yamalube 20-50 .

Any feedback is appreciated. 

[Devilman]

15 hours ago, D.A. said:

That is an intriguing comment! 

Are you saying you WANTED to be able to use high octane gasoline and that’s one of the reasons you had your ECU flashed? If so, can you explain why?

I’m confused because while advancing spark timing at certain RPMs can be advantageous, having to pay more for high octane fuel seems like a clear disadvantage. 

Yeah I wanted the high octane fuel to get the most out of the motor. It is only a few bucks more per tank so it was worth it to me. With the flash it is peppier and also they adjusted the engine braking down so it was not so abrupt. The only bike I've experience on is a 2018 Rebel 500. The MT-07 seemed to have a lot of engine braking and seemed on this forum people also complained about it. Plus I didn't want all the extra controllers you have to get from dyno tech for different things. The only extra is my HealTech Quickshift controller.

Edited May 4, 2021 by Devilman

[D.A.]

On 5/4/2021 at 1:07 PM, Devilman said:

... I wanted the high octane fuel to get the most out of the motor ...

Every reason you listed makes perfect sense except the line above.

(Please don't take this personally, @Devilman. I just like pontificating about subjects like this and your post has presented me with the opportunity.)

A lot of people have the misconception there is more power in high octane fuel when that is not necessarily the case. In fact, when it comes to the fuel sold at gas stations, the opposite is true: the lower the octane number, the higher the power, or more precisely, the greater the energy. A gallon of Regular Unleaded, for instance, contains MORE energy than a gallon of Premium Unleaded because the additives in the Premium dilute the combustibility of the fuel.

You know how drug dealers in movies are often shown cutting pure cocaine with baking powder? That's similar to what's happening with gasoline: petroleum companies basically take Regular Unleaded and cut it with additives to create Premium Unleaded and since those additives provide little if any combustible energy, the resulting fuel has less potential energy than it originally did.

Because of this, if you take a vehicle designed to use Regular Unleaded and fill it with Premium Unleaded, that vehicle's motor will actually create slightly LESS power and have LESS acceleration. Therefore it is not logical to want to use a higher octane fuel than needed.

Professional race car and motorcycle teams would love to be able to use cheap, readily available, plain old Regular gasoline instead of shelling out the big bucks for specialty fuels. So why don't they?

Simple: because of compression. Engines in cars and motorcycles designed for racing have very high compression ratios. That's because the most effective way to squeeze more power out an engine at all RPMs is to increase the compression since the higher the ratio, the greater the downward push of the piston.

Unfortunately, when you compress fuel, you also create heat. Compress too much and the heat generated will cause fuel to self-detonate – meaning explode. Unwanted detonations are referred to as knock or pinging. And it's not something you want to happen inside of your motorcycle engine. Knock can cause serious damage if it happens at the wrong time during the combustion cycle. Much better if your ECU (rather than excessive heat) determines when to ignite the fuel.

Once you modify an engine to make more compression, you need to switch to a fuel that can withstand the increased heat. To create such a fuel, petroleum companies put additives into their fuel – additives that increase the heat tolerance of the gasoline so it does not burn until ignited by the spark plug.

It's not precisely the same scenario with high end racing fuels because some of them do increase power through use of oxygenation or alcohol-based fluids. But the general idea is consistent.

In regards to 2WDW flashing an ECU, they will advance the spark timing at high RPMs to eliminate power loss in that zone but that adjustment will require you to switch to Premium gasoline. That's not because of the compression-related issues I detailed above. You cannot change compression ratio via ECU flashing. Rather, it's because Regular Unleaded, being a more efficient fuel than Premium, also has a faster flame speed than Premium and that fast flame speed can cause the fuel to finish burning too early, which, coincidentally, also results in knock. Switching to Premium, with it's slow flame speed, avoids that issue.

But unless you increase compression somehow, Premium won't give you any extra power. If anything, it will slightly reduce overall power.

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by D.A.