2WDW Quick Review

[batscat]

What you wrote is contradicting. You can now power wheelie in second so more midrange power not less. I think your butt dyno is broken.

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

What you wrote is contradicting. You can now power wheelie in second so more midrange power not less. I think your butt dyno is broken.

It's definitely something. Hard to describe, but @phicurious86 explained it best. The difference between 90 degree weather and 60 degree weather is a huge difference. 

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

Update [HASH]2:
 
Took a 200 mile trip today. Close to 400 miles on the flash. I can confirm that the warm weather was the culprit in regards to power loss. It was around 85 today and the bike felt great, I just felt like it had a little more in it. On my trip home it was about 71 the entire way indicated on the dash.
 
The bike was an absolute monster at those temps. Power everywhere. From 4k-redline. It pulled smooth and hard. In a full tuck power shifting from 2-3 at 10,500rpm it picked up the wheel hard and held it for about 50 feet on a slight downhill road. The bike is amazingly smooth.
 
According to mileage on my trip divided by gallons put in, I got 54.38mpg on Shell 93, which is only about 2-3 miles lower than my previous averages. And that was riding it pretty hard, over 7-8k rpm for at least half the tank.
 
I was fooling around with a buddy who has a 2012 STi with a few mods and he was trying to dial in his tune. So while he was data-logging with a laptop and g-timer I was just going 0-quarter mile with him. We did about 10 runs and his best time according to the g-timer was a 12.64 at 111mph. On that run I was at least 5-6 car lengths ahead and was pulling away up to about 105mph, that's when I saw in the mirror he probably would've caught me if we kept going. Anyway, to make a long story a bit longer, before the flash I would pull a couple car lengths on him to 100 then get properly passed by 110.
 
So, I would recommend the flash to anyone who wants a bike ridiculously smooth, power until redline, and arguably a healthier running bike in general.

[redbeard]

Nice review! Just installed my M4 exhaust today and my ECU is also on its way back from 2WDW now, can't wait to get it installed and see the difference.

[bino]

I have sent them an email 3 days ago and they have yet to answer. Does anybody know how long do they take to answer emails? Should I send another one in case it went into their spam folder or wait some extra days?
 
How long have you guys got an answer after sending an email.
 
(For other businesses I usually get an answer within 48 hours)
 
Edit: Just received an email from them

[Guest 2wheeler]

  3) The powerband for the bike is completely different. Stock had a big grunt from 5k-8k, after that power seemed to slowly taper off and by redline you could barely feel the acceleration anymore. The onset of stock power was instant and violent. After the flash, it's so smooth it's hard to tell if the bike actually is even faster (althought this could very well be related the weather). However, the grunt is gone. It's not violent anymore, it's a smooth pull that gets harder and harder until redline which is definitely going to be hard to get used to.

WOW! I have mixed thoughts about my flash. I just installed the ECU tonight, and went for about a 25 mile night ride. ChicagoAJ summarized my thoughts well in the quoted parargaph. It is a completely different powerband, and it ain't violent anymore. I didn't realize how much I like that violent power hit until it was gone. Don't get me wrong there is a ton of power, and it runs darn smooth which was much nicer in the corners as between the less jerkiness in the throttle and a real reduction in the engine braking, it just handles better. 
I had the ECU flashed for a stock pipe with the snorkle removed. Gotta tell ya, I do not like the sound of the snorkle removed with the stock pipe - might sound better with a good pipe.
 
Jury is out for the moment on this one.
 
 

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

  3) The powerband for the bike is completely different. Stock had a big grunt from 5k-8k, after that power seemed to slowly taper off and by redline you could barely feel the acceleration anymore. The onset of stock power was instant and violent. After the flash, it's so smooth it's hard to tell if the bike actually is even faster (althought this could very well be related the weather). However, the grunt is gone. It's not violent anymore, it's a smooth pull that gets harder and harder until redline which is definitely going to be hard to get used to.

WOW! I have mixed thoughts about my flash. I just installed the ECU tonight, and went for about a 25 mile night ride. ChicagoAJ summarized my thoughts well in the quoted parargaph. It is a completely different powerband, and it ain't violent anymore. I didn't realize how much I like that violent power hit until it was gone. Don't get me wrong there is a ton of power, and it runs darn smooth which was much nicer in the corners as between the less jerkiness in the throttle and a real reduction in the engine braking, it just handles better. 
I had the ECU flashed for a stock pipe with the snorkle removed. Gotta tell ya, I do not like the sound of the snorkle removed with the stock pipe - might sound better with a good pipe.
 
Jury is out for the moment on this one.
 

Just wait until you take it to 100+. It gets there a heck of a lot faster and doesn't feel like it's going to rattle apart doing it. As far as the intake noise, I'll bet it's louder than the exhaust with a stock pipe. I still hear it with my Akra and headphones in, haha.  
I'm still not use to smooth power delivery. I feel like the bike is so slow in 2nd and 3rd, then I look down and I'm doing almost 90. 

[Guest 2wheeler]

Well, truth be known, I had it come up in 2nd a couple of times last night, and it was pretty effortlessly. I also noticed that it appeared to go up to higher speeds a lot quicker. More experimentation is definitely going to be needed.
 
So about that damn snorkle noise, I talked with the guys at 2WDW today, and they said that it should work fine with the snorkle reinstalled with the exception that is will take a hit in the midrange. They also were pretty pro-Yoshi for a pipe. I just may buy the cheap stainless Yoshi, and give that a shot for a while to mute that intake sound.
 

[bmwpowere36m3]

I should be getting my ECU back this week. Were you running premium before the flash?

[lovakhan]

I should be getting my ECU back this week. Were you running premium before the flash?

2wdw suggested i run premium but im running with an akra Ti as well.

[bmwpowere36m3]

I'm curious as far as Akra carbon owners go...

[robborboy]

Thabks for the write up. This definitely settles me on staying away.
 
I love the engine braking, and given that half the year I ride in freezing to subs freezing temperatures and even sub 0s, this sound like it completely neuters the bike.

[mjh937]

Thabks for the write up. This definitely settles me on staying away.  
I love the engine braking, and given that half the year I ride in freezing to subs freezing temperatures and even sub 0s, this sound like it completely neuters the bike.

I am not sure how more power throughout the rev range "completely neuters the bike" (check out the dyno chests). Of course if you like the engine braking that is a good reason not to do the flash. I am going to get it done next month mostly to get rid of the engine braking. 

[robborboy]

Thabks for the write up. This definitely settles me on staying away.  
I love the engine braking, and given that half the year I ride in freezing to subs freezing temperatures and even sub 0s, this sound like it completely neuters the bike.

I am not sure how more power throughout the rev range "completely neuters the bike" (check out the dyno chests). Of course if you like the engine braking that is a good reason not to do the flash. I am going to get it done next month mostly to get rid of the engine braking. 

Based on his own description the temperature outside hinders performance insanely. This is not anything that I've noticed under the stock configuration.

[bmwpowere36m3]

The ability to alter engine braking % is there... just whether the tuner will do it or not.

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

I can't believe I haven't been getting any notifications people have been posting in this thread I started. Sorry!
 
@bmwpowere36m3 - I was running mid grade which is either 89 or 91 around my parts prior to the flash. Premium is 93+ here. Never tried to run anything other than premium after the flash and for an extra $1 per tank I'm not going to bother experimenting with different octanes. Especially since 2WDW recommends 91 or higher for all exhausts. It may not be necessary, but I'll take the higher octane ceiling in case I get a batch of sub-par fuel. 
 
@robborboy - The power delivery is completely different. Before the flash I couldn't get the bike to power wheelie in 2nd more than an inch, if even that. Now I can power wheelie in 2nd for 50 feet or so without full throttle. Instead of making power low to mid range, the bike is now more supersport like. All the power is mid to high revs and it comes on so smoothly it's hard to even notice the bike makes more power. If you're riding in 0 degree temperatures (assuming Fahrenheit) - you should, without a doubt, notice that the bike runs slower in 50-60 degree temps. This is a characteristic of all internal combustion engines. Colder, denser air will always make more power than warm, humid air. 
 
 
 
After about 1,500 miles on the flash I'm still averaging low 50 miles per gallon when calculated at the pump and that's not riding very conservatively at all. I still love the bike, engine braking seems like it's settled down to about 20% of what it was in the higher gears (4th, 5th, 6th), in the lower gears it all depends how abruptly you let off the throttle - it'll engine brake just as hard as before if you're at 50% throttle or more and just let it snap shut. But if you roll of the throttle gradually by the time it's closed you won't even know. Going down large hills the bike stays a constant speed when off the throttle completely.
 
One of the best parts about the flash that I've noticed (especially in stop and go traffic) is that the cooling fan comes on around 200 degrees, prior to the flash it was 225 degree, I believe. This 25 degrees makes a huge different in the heat soaked up around my legs when sitting at idle. The bike also gets down to 172 quicker too once I'm up and moving again.
 
Another notable small change that makes a huge difference is the idle was changed to around 1100rpms. Which seems low compared to stock, but when taking off from a light the bike just wanted to go, go, go. The power is instant (this might be the R6 tube though). If you really want to feel the power difference from stock to flash - start from a light in 2nd like you would normally do in 1st when getting on it hard. The bike pulls decent to 6k then absolutely takes off to 10k (I've had some pretty close to 3 second flat 0-60 runs when doing this). As I've said before, more supersport-y powerband.
 
I'm still sticking with my previous claim that 1st feels like a near gear. 2nd feels like pre-flash 1st. 3rd feels like 2nd, etc.
 
 
That's about all I can think of right now, again sorry for being absent from this thread - haven't been notified of new posts for whatever reason.

[ssdawood]

Notifications have stopped for me too. I don't know of I changed sone setting or its the forums.

[robborboy]

I can't believe I haven't been getting any notifications people have been posting in this thread I started. Sorry! 
@bmwpowere36m3 - I was running mid grade which is either 89 or 91 around my parts prior to the flash. Premium is 93+ here. Never tried to run anything other than premium after the flash and for an extra $1 per tank I'm not going to bother experimenting with different octanes. Especially since 2WDW recommends 91 or higher for all exhausts. It may not be necessary, but I'll take the higher octane ceiling in case I get a batch of sub-par fuel. 
 
@robborboy - The power delivery is completely different. Before the flash I couldn't get the bike to power wheelie in 2nd more than an inch, if even that. Now I can power wheelie in 2nd for 50 feet or so without full throttle. Instead of making power low to mid range, the bike is now more supersport like. All the power is mid to high revs and it comes on so smoothly it's hard to even notice the bike makes more power. If you're riding in 0 degree temperatures (assuming Fahrenheit) - you should, without a doubt, notice that the bike runs slower in 50-60 degree temps. This is a characteristic of all internal combustion engines. Colder, denser air will always make more power than warm, humid air. 
 
 
 
After about 1,500 miles on the flash I'm still averaging low 50 miles per gallon when calculated at the pump and that's not riding very conservatively at all. I still love the bike, engine braking seems like it's settled down to about 20% of what it was in the higher gears (4th, 5th, 6th), in the lower gears it all depends how abruptly you let off the throttle - it'll engine brake just as hard as before if you're at 50% throttle or more and just let it snap shut. But if you roll of the throttle gradually by the time it's closed you won't even know. Going down large hills the bike stays a constant speed when off the throttle completely.
 
One of the best parts about the flash that I've noticed (especially in stop and go traffic) is that the cooling fan comes on around 200 degrees, prior to the flash it was 225 degree, I believe. This 25 degrees makes a huge different in the heat soaked up around my legs when sitting at idle. The bike also gets down to 172 quicker too once I'm up and moving again.
 
Another notable small change that makes a huge difference is the idle was changed to around 1100rpms. Which seems low compared to stock, but when taking off from a light the bike just wanted to go, go, go. The power is instant (this might be the R6 tube though). If you really want to feel the power difference from stock to flash - start from a light in 2nd like you would normally do in 1st when getting on it hard. The bike pulls decent to 6k then absolutely takes off to 10k (I've had some pretty close to 3 second flat 0-60 runs when doing this). As I've said before, more supersport-y powerband.
 
I'm still sticking with my previous claim that 1st feels like a near gear. 2nd feels like pre-flash 1st. 3rd feels like 2nd, etc.
 
 
That's about all I can think of right now, again sorry for being absent from this thread - haven't been notified of new posts for whatever reason.

 
 
Having owned several i4s, only one I truly loved, I'd say that isn't really a positive to me at least. i4s from.the R6 and R1 to the 636 and Zx10r just feel, I don't know how to describe it, surgical. I much prefer the grunt of a thumper or v-twin.
 
As far as characteristics of and ICE, I'm well aware, that is a benefit of having a CAI installed on one. However with an engine like this, or even even my Ninja 650, these lower performance engine with mild compression and small chambers fun fairly samey when I am out at 0f or 100f.

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

I can't believe I haven't been getting any notifications people have been posting in this thread I started. Sorry! 
@bmwpowere36m3 - I was running mid grade which is either 89 or 91 around my parts prior to the flash. Premium is 93+ here. Never tried to run anything other than premium after the flash and for an extra $1 per tank I'm not going to bother experimenting with different octanes. Especially since 2WDW recommends 91 or higher for all exhausts. It may not be necessary, but I'll take the higher octane ceiling in case I get a batch of sub-par fuel. 
 
@robborboy - The power delivery is completely different. Before the flash I couldn't get the bike to power wheelie in 2nd more than an inch, if even that. Now I can power wheelie in 2nd for 50 feet or so without full throttle. Instead of making power low to mid range, the bike is now more supersport like. All the power is mid to high revs and it comes on so smoothly it's hard to even notice the bike makes more power. If you're riding in 0 degree temperatures (assuming Fahrenheit) - you should, without a doubt, notice that the bike runs slower in 50-60 degree temps. This is a characteristic of all internal combustion engines. Colder, denser air will always make more power than warm, humid air. 
 
 
 
After about 1,500 miles on the flash I'm still averaging low 50 miles per gallon when calculated at the pump and that's not riding very conservatively at all. I still love the bike, engine braking seems like it's settled down to about 20% of what it was in the higher gears (4th, 5th, 6th), in the lower gears it all depends how abruptly you let off the throttle - it'll engine brake just as hard as before if you're at 50% throttle or more and just let it snap shut. But if you roll of the throttle gradually by the time it's closed you won't even know. Going down large hills the bike stays a constant speed when off the throttle completely.
 
One of the best parts about the flash that I've noticed (especially in stop and go traffic) is that the cooling fan comes on around 200 degrees, prior to the flash it was 225 degree, I believe. This 25 degrees makes a huge different in the heat soaked up around my legs when sitting at idle. The bike also gets down to 172 quicker too once I'm up and moving again.
 
Another notable small change that makes a huge difference is the idle was changed to around 1100rpms. Which seems low compared to stock, but when taking off from a light the bike just wanted to go, go, go. The power is instant (this might be the R6 tube though). If you really want to feel the power difference from stock to flash - start from a light in 2nd like you would normally do in 1st when getting on it hard. The bike pulls decent to 6k then absolutely takes off to 10k (I've had some pretty close to 3 second flat 0-60 runs when doing this). As I've said before, more supersport-y powerband.
 
I'm still sticking with my previous claim that 1st feels like a near gear. 2nd feels like pre-flash 1st. 3rd feels like 2nd, etc.
 
 
That's about all I can think of right now, again sorry for being absent from this thread - haven't been notified of new posts for whatever reason.

Having owned several i4s, only one I truly loved, I'd say that isn't really a positive to me at least. i4s from.the R6 and R1 to the 636 and Zx10r just feel, I don't know how to describe it, surgical. I much prefer the grunt of a thumper or v-twin.
 
As far as characteristics of and ICE, I'm well aware, that is a benefit of having a CAI installed on one. However with an engine like this, or even even my Ninja 650, these lower performance engine with mild compression and small chambers fun fairly samey when I am out at 0f or 100f.

I don't really know what you're trying to say because it's pretty hard to follow - not sure if it's autocorrect or what. But I'm telling you what this bike feels like after the flash. It's faster and has more power because the delivery of power is smoother makes it feel less violent, that doesn't mean it's automatically the exact same as an inline 4 supersport. Obviously an R1 or other inline 4 bike is going to feel surgical, they're thousands if not double the price of our little bargain bike - but if a ~$300 dollar flash makes it feel like one of those, what's to complain about?  
And why don't you do some track runs and prove to me what I already know - colder weather will give you better times 100 times out of 100 (traction permitting). If you honestly think your bike has the exact same power at 0F compared to 100F, you're out of your mind. This is why most tuners will wait for a nice cool day with low humidity to tune. These "lower performance" engines will 100% make less power in warmer weather. 

[robborboy]

Having owned several i4s, only one I truly loved, I'd say that isn't really a positive to me at least. i4s from.the R6 and R1 to the 636 and Zx10r just feel, I don't know how to describe it, surgical. I much prefer the grunt of a thumper or v-twin. 
As far as characteristics of and ICE, I'm well aware, that is a benefit of having a CAI installed on one. However with an engine like this, or even even my Ninja 650, these lower performance engine with mild compression and small chambers fun fairly samey when I am out at 0f or 100f.

I don't really know what you're trying to say because it's pretty hard to follow - not sure if it's autocorrect or what. But I'm telling you what this bike feels like after the flash. It's faster and has more power because the delivery of power is smoother makes it feel less violent, that doesn't mean it's automatically the exact same as an inline 4 supersport. Obviously an R1 or other inline 4 bike is going to feel surgical, they're thousands if not double the price of our little bargain bike - but if a ~$300 dollar flash makes it feel like one of those, what's to complain about?  
And why don't you do some track runs and prove to me what I already know - colder weather will give you better times 100 times out of 100 (traction permitting). If you honestly think your bike has the exact same power at 0F compared to 100F, you're out of your mind. This is why most tuners will wait for a nice cool day with low humidity to tune. These "lower performance" engines will 100% make less power in warmer weather. 

Please don't misunderstand. I'm just saying with stock time my butt dyno doesn't notice a different between riding in freezing temperaturs or stupidly hot summer temperatures. I'm also not debating that cold air increases performance. That is why I mentioned the benefit of a CAI. Just that I have no desire to have a tune that make the bike perform noticeably different depending on the weather. My FZ07 is my little dual sport adventuring hooolagin bike. Shaving seconds off track time doesn't do anything for me. That is what a track bike is for me. I just want my small packaged rough and tumble v-twin like engine growling for me. Something you've describe this tune as changing past what I'd like.
 
Really not trying to start an argument. Just thanking you for telling me why this is not for me.

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

I should be getting my ECU back this week. Were you running premium before the flash?

You ever get your ECU back? Curious to hear your thoughts.

[bmwpowere36m3]

I should be getting my ECU back this week. Were you running premium before the flash?

You ever get your ECU back? Curious to hear your thoughts.

Yup and got about 80 miles on it, only a day of riding... still had almost full-tank of 87 in it.
Initial impressions:
* Starts seem longer* Idle speed seems slightly lower, but definitely less stable (more burbly) once warmed up (though never stalled).* Has not stalled (or shown signs) from take-off* Smoother transition from off-to-on throttle* Engine braking reduced, but it varies depending on gear and RPM (still a good amount of braking)* Less decel popping, but still very present with Akra Carbon (no baffle)* Overall feels smoother, but it hard to say whether its more powerful (haven't really hammered it with 87 in the tank)
Biggest peeve at the moment is a bunch of times rolling on the throttle the engine would hesitate and all of a sudden take off... seemed mostly to happen when transitioning out of ECO mode (4th gear, ~4k) and a few times in 5th.  With more aggressive inputs its didn't hesitate.
 

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

You ever get your ECU back? Curious to hear your thoughts.

Yup and got about 80 miles on it, only a day of riding... still had almost full-tank of 87 in it.
Initial impressions:
* Starts seem longer* Idle speed seems slightly lower, but definitely less stable (more burbly) once warmed up (though never stalled).* Has not stalled (or shown signs) from take-off* Smoother transition from off-to-on throttle* Engine braking reduced, but it varies depending on gear and RPM (still a good amount of braking)* Less decel popping, but still very present with Akra Carbon (no baffle)* Overall feels smoother, but it hard to say whether its more powerful (haven't really hammered it with 87 in the tank)
Biggest peeve at the moment is a bunch of times rolling on the throttle the engine would hesitate and all of a sudden take off... seemed mostly to happen when transitioning out of ECO mode (4th gear, ~4k) and a few times in 5th.  With more aggressive inputs its didn't hesitate.

Give it a few hundred miles. Everything is learning right now, after you've gotten more seat time I'm sure your impressions will change. My idle is lower too, but I've never experienced the less stable feeling. Most of the time I don't even notice the bike is on it's so smooth at idle (however, I have my db killer in - maybe that's the difference). Also, when I start from a stop it's ready to go from 1100rpm onward, never once had a feeling like it would die (not sure if you have the R6 tube, maybe that's the case for me).  
I would also try running premium, especially if you want to get on it hard. 

[bmwpowere36m3]

Yup and got about 80 miles on it, only a day of riding... still had almost full-tank of 87 in it.
Initial impressions:
* Starts seem longer* Idle speed seems slightly lower, but definitely less stable (more burbly) once warmed up (though never stalled).* Has not stalled (or shown signs) from take-off* Smoother transition from off-to-on throttle* Engine braking reduced, but it varies depending on gear and RPM (still a good amount of braking)* Less decel popping, but still very present with Akra Carbon (no baffle)* Overall feels smoother, but it hard to say whether its more powerful (haven't really hammered it with 87 in the tank)
Biggest peeve at the moment is a bunch of times rolling on the throttle the engine would hesitate and all of a sudden take off... seemed mostly to happen when transitioning out of ECO mode (4th gear, ~4k) and a few times in 5th.  With more aggressive inputs its didn't hesitate.

Give it a few hundred miles. Everything is learning right now, after you've gotten more seat time I'm sure your impressions will change. My idle is lower too, but I've never experienced the less stable feeling. Most of the time I don't even notice the bike is on it's so smooth at idle (however, I have my db killer in - maybe that's the difference). Also, when I start from a stop it's ready to go from 1100rpm onward, never once had a feeling like it would die (not sure if you have the R6 tube, maybe that's the case for me).  
I would also try running premium, especially if you want to get on it hard. 

Its idles fine and smooth... just seems to hunt more when its warmed up.  It does however respond much better from a standstill... whereas prior to the flash, at times, it would almost stumble or die.
Got the R6 tube as well.
 

[Guest ChicagoAJ]

Give it a few hundred miles. Everything is learning right now, after you've gotten more seat time I'm sure your impressions will change. My idle is lower too, but I've never experienced the less stable feeling. Most of the time I don't even notice the bike is on it's so smooth at idle (however, I have my db killer in - maybe that's the difference). Also, when I start from a stop it's ready to go from 1100rpm onward, never once had a feeling like it would die (not sure if you have the R6 tube, maybe that's the case for me).  
I would also try running premium, especially if you want to get on it hard. 

Its idles fine and smooth... just seems to hunt more when its warmed up.  It does however respond much better from a standstill... whereas prior to the flash, at times, it would almost stumble or die.
Got the R6 tube as well.

I get that, it just wants to go all the time. Hard to ride at a constant pace as easily as it was before (especially with the R6 tube). Any little bump/wrist input is now picked up by the engine.