Your thoughts on air cooled modern bikes.

[SkH]

Specifics and to the point: 

R Nine T Pure.  No commuting.  Just joy-rides in general.  WA State... no big deal?

Longs:

Wife wants to ditch her R3 for a classic bike- but not an actual classic bike.  She rides my FZ07 from time to time so she is used to the stronger power band.  Honestly she should just get an SR400 but she really doesn't like the idea of kick starting.

 

So now it is down to 2 bikes.  Triumph Street Twin.  Or R Nine T Pure.  They both will have identical seat heights (30 inches with slim seat accessory on R Nine T).  They both weigh around the same 480 range wet.  They are both priced similarly.  But the Triumph is liquid while the R Nine T is air cooled.

 

Riding together, only once have we been in a traffic standstill in 4 years.

 

Thoughts on air cooled in this situation?  Which bike would you get?   Pics for those visual people:

 

[MT27]

Lot's of those BMW's running around in Fl and TX with no problems.

 

[robbo10]

I suppose in a hot climate the choice might be liquid cooling?

[gregjet]

Nothing wrong with air cooling par see . Take a look at the GS500 Suzi. Sufficent power to tour ( one up really) and big reliability ( leaky carb notwithstanding, but that's nothing to do with cooling. Oh and it really is partially oil cooled). Been around for long enough that any decent manufacturer has developed it to a pretty good point BUT!

Good liquid cooling is betterer. For a bunch of reasons amongst which are tighter tolerences and better fuel economy. True water cooling is an extra thing to go wrong , but cars have been doing it for a very long time and modern "water" cooling is pretty reliable ( OK plastic radiators really only have a limited lifespan).

[norcal616]

Modern day Fuel Injection kickstart, is a breeze... Even in the deal of winter, 3-4 slow kicks to "prime system"(it's what I call it), then a good ole kick will fire it up...

Air cooled= less stuff to break down

 

BUT Triumph has always had problems with "service work/warranty work"(ridiculous downtimes/hassle) in my neck of the woods... 

[sorkyah]

 

I would choose the triumph, but only because I haven't ridden the r9 

 

 

Would you be trading in the R3 @SkH

I'm looking for one for the GF

 

[Zephyr]

If I had the $, availability, and service tech then I would have gotten the R9T over the FZ07.  I do however love the FZ07 and do not plan on getting rid of it... ever?  But I adore the looks of the R9T and reviews that I trust indicate that it's a great bike.  Triumph always seemed low on power/weight ratio to me, but comfy for casual cruising.  I don't think that air cooled would be an issue in WA.

Edited April 25, 2019 by Zephyr

[Beemer]

Not saying this is a great bike, don't know much about it but it may be just what you're looking for. It's a standard, which she wants, it's liquid cooled which is nice, it has more power than the 300, it has a 30" seat height which she would like, it is styled a little like our beloved FZ/MT-07 so you two would match more which = cuter, lol! It's way cheaper than the Triumph or the BMW and *lighter, plus, she doesn't have to kick start it. What I also like is the fact that it's a parallel-twin. Edit: just noticed, it has a 4.5 gallon tank which is very nice!

2019 CB500F Overview - Honda Powersports

POWERSPORTS.HONDA.COM

---

2019 CB500F

I only suggest this bike because after taking everything into consideration I figured you two must've overlooked this bike because logic would dictate that your wife would rather have a bike that's a little lighter and cheaper than the two mentioned. My aim was to help, not derail. Sorry if I upset the order. 

[robbo10]

My Honda Rebel has the same 500 engine. But hey we've drifted way from the two bikes of the original choice

[zooman72]

@gregjet summed it up best - slight nod to the Triumph for that, especially if your wife is not looking for a lot more HP (BMW makes 110hp/ 86lb vs. Triumph's 64hp/ 59lb)

Personally, I love Triumphs (Dad had an old Bonneville when I was a wee lad), and I am currently lusting over the new 1200cc Speed Twin (a.k.a Thruxton w/ better ergos), along with the Indian FTR 1200 and Kawasaki z900rs (and a few others).  However, if I was going to grab a BMW, it would be the R9T Pure (not a fan of wire wheels). 

I think with the two bikes you are choosing from, that the Triumph may have slightly better ergos, although your wife would have to ride both to be sure.  Also, with females typically having smaller hands, the Triumph's "torque-assist" clutch might be quite useful too.  The Brembo front brakes, cartridge front forks (non-adjustable) and dual riding modes might be noticeable and appreciated too.

@Beemers's suggestion of the Honda CB500F is actually pretty good (very nice bike, and Honda's are fantastically reliable, although it is only available in red), but doesn't meet the "modern classic" styling requirement - although as I get older and my beat-up hands/ fingers weaker, slipper-assist clutches (which the Honda has) become sweeter.  The new instrument display is much better this year too.

[Beemer]

6 hours ago, robbo10 said:

My Honda Rebel has the same 500 engine. But hey we've drifted way from the two bikes of the original choice

Oh yeah, I forgot about those strict forum rules that state you aren't allowed to drift, make suggestions or play moderator. I'm really glad I didn't drift and talk about a GS500.

[kylerhsm]

Both lovely bikes and I'd own either of them if I had a bit more cash (or sold one of my other bikes).

However I think it's really doing to come down to what your lady feels the most comfortable on. The Street Twin is a smaller bike overall, and no doubt would be much smoother to ride. So if she's after an easy going classic then you can't go wrong.

Please don't get an SR400 though. Absolutely gutless... and boring... and this is coming from someone who loves their old school bikes. 

[SkH]

Wow, this topic had no replies for nearly a month, I gave up on it.  Thanks for the replies everyone.

@sorkyah it will definitely be a trade in.  Our last house had a 4 car garage, I can see having 4 bikes there, but we moved to a better neighborhood and we are now down to a 3 car garage and amazingly enough, that less of a space dealt a major blow and I cannot have 4 bikes in the garage no matter how I try.  Also what are you implying, that I sell you the bike!  Haha, dude you are Arizona.  But despite that, with jobs and the fact that we are using every single bit of free time with home renovations on our new home... ugh.  I won't be trailering anything cross state anytime soon.  Sorry bud.  But if you want to hear my recommendations of the r3 in general, I have nothing but good things to say about it. 

@Beemer Yeah, we did look at modern bikes.  But she has consistently dreamt for years of riding a more classic bike.  Every time we pass by something that has a more retro/classic look, her comments, her intonation.  She greatly longs for a classic looking standard.

@kylerhsm @norcal616 SR400 definitely is off the table.  She's a woman, her emotions will win out every time and she feels a disgust towards kickstarting.  That disgust will never be over come.

 

Anyway, she gravitates towards the Triumph.  I obviously would gravitate towards the rNinet I had to throw that in for her to think about.  But most likely it will be the Triumph.  It is the smaller bike, liquid cooled, cheaper. 

[shinyribs]

Nothing at all wrong with air cooling. Aside from  the lean mixtures FI bikes are prone to seeing at low rpm's, liquid cooling is a bit overrated IMO. I've spent hours upon hours absolutely hammering air cooled thumpers in the woods on 100 degree+ days. Lots of heavy throttle, very little air flow. I commonly get my old XR so hot that the heat from the engine rises up and boils the gas. Can't kill it!

 

[Benh972]

Some people love air cooled bikes, and they seem to work just fine for them. I don't like air cooling, but it is not really a logical dislike. Just kind of a turn off, because it looks primitive on the spec sheet.

I've wanted to setup a custom liquid cooling loop for my pc for over 10 years. However I always just end up bolting up a big heat sink and fans.. it does not get the same results, but its comparatively cheap and easy.

So I am a big fan of water cooling.. when I don't have to design the cooling system.

[DewMan]

22 minutes ago, Benh972 said:

Some people love air cooled bikes, and they seem to work just fine for them. I don't like air cooling, but it is not really a logical dislike. Just kind of a turn off, because it looks primitive on the spec sheet.

I've wanted to setup a custom liquid cooling loop for my pc for over 10 years. However I always just end up bolting up a big heat sink and fans.. it does not get the same results, but its comparatively cheap and easy.

So I am a big fan of water cooling.. when I don't have to design the cooling system. 

I've owned air cooled bikes, that would get so hot sitting in Florida summer traffic you could smell it overheating. But that was back in the 80s. I'll assume air cooled bikes have improved since then.

I'm right there with you with water cooling my PC. I've built a water cooled gaming rig that never gets above room temps on either the CPU or the dual Titan GPUs.  I don't ever plan to go back to an air cooled PC.

A water cooled bike is a bit more complex but I  feel the added cooling potential is worth it.

[Beemer]

I think that's cool that she wants a nostalgic bike because I'm right on board with a Triumph for that. I like the twins a lot and my bike of choice would be the Triumph T120 Range. I hope she'll be OK with a bigger bike like the Street Twin. Y'all have fun, be safe!

Edit: Just commenting about the differences between a liquid cooled bike and air cooled, Most of my bikes have been air cooled and I've never had any performance issues with them (some comfort issues) but I will say that it seemed the bigger the engines were the more I felt the heat from the engine. I used to ride all day on smaller bikes such as a Honda 70, Honda XL100, and Yamaha DT100 and never had a problem with engine heat bothering me. My Yamaha XT350 and Honda XL500 on the other hand I could feel the heat from and it could be bothersome at times but nothing extreme or I would've ditched them. I figure they just had bigger single cylinder motors that generated more heat. 

I would have another if I really liked the bike a lot but would 'prefer' liquid cooling for inner thigh comfort in the city where you really notice the difference between the two. I have had a few "Geez, that's hot" moments but they dissipated when I got moving.