Impulse Movement Emulators

[7fold]

I'm not sure if anyone on the forums have experience or has even heard of these things - but I came across them while browsing Reddit one day and it looks interesting. I'm curious to see what other people's takes are on something like this 

Prime Series Emulator – Impulse Movement

 

Install looks dead simple - remove fork cap, pull out the spacer and spring, screw this thing in at the bottom of the spring and put everything back in. It's half the cost of the Traxxion AR-25 kit, but I'm wondering if the results are at all similar.

 

 

[tomlichu]

No experience, but just from a quick look, it looks like it was 3D printed.

I have my doubts about the durability of this part if this is going to control fork oil flow. I have had my 3D printed parts (PLA and PETG) deform on a hot day in the sun. Granted, PLA is not good for heat, PETG is rated for 80 C, and ABS 100 C before deforming. Heat will weaken plastic regardless. Wonder how these will fair after riding in a heatwave.

3D printed plastics are not as strong as plastics made in cast, molds, or subtractive manufacturing. Layer by layer printed parts have low resistance to shearing forces and are more likely to delaminate. I wonder if the pressure and flow of fork oil (with impurities) will wear away the plastic faster due to erosion than metal emulators.

I would not risk it when compared to the reputation of bigger companies like Traxxion. The innovation seems cool, and I hope it works out for this creator. Though this seems too risky on the consumer side.

 

Edited June 5, 2023 by tomlichu
grammar

[Subito]

The text on the Impulse Movement website suggests these folks are…um, what’s the word? Clueless.

Edited June 5, 2023 by Subito

[7fold]

I had the same thoughts on the parts being 3D printed. I know some of the printer filaments can be pretty tough (like the ones infused with carbon fiber), but I have no idea what filament is used for these  so my first thought was what happens if it falls apart inside the fork haha.

As for all the descriptions and backstory, I don't know why the proposed solutions are either use emulators or completely change the front forks when there are plenty of other options haha, but it might just be the creator pushing his product. 

I'm no suspension guru by any means, but I just thought the concept and design were really interesting and was wondering why I haven't seen anyone else go that route. I was thinking either this guy is super clever and is on to something or perhaps some of the other suspension manufacturers haven't come up with their own version of this particular solution because it could potentially lead to issues. Either way, I thought it was kind of cool, but I'm not brave enough to give it a shot haha.

[Pursuvant]

It is possible, for ideas to completely up-end an entire well established modern global industry. A plastic curtain rod maker turned his attention on a different industry, and bested hundreds year old industry giants overnight, caught them all unaware by an idea. His name is Gaston Glock

[Subito]

Paul Thede, the founder of Race Tech, invented Cartridge Emulators three decades ago. I find his innovative approaches to suspension tuning and design a bit more compelling:

 

[klx678]

Good informative video there.   Thanks for bringing it to the subject.

[Impulse.Movement]

Hello, 

I want to start off by saying thank you for you interest in my product. There is nothing quite like it on the market because it is novel design with unconventional features. You are correct that the parts are 3D printed and that some methods of 3d printing can produce heat sensitive components with poor layer adhesion. Most consumers are printing with polylactic acid (PLA) because of the ease of use and print quality. Early on in development PLA was tested as a material candidate because of a high tensile strength but it does end up deforming over time with heat and pressure. The parts are now "printed" from a toughened polycarbonate, and heat treated to create a tempered part capable of withstanding the harsh conditions inside of a motorcycle fork. Unless you plan on riding next to a river of lave the parts will withstand heat just fine. 

These parts use a multi staged valving system that dynamically changes the damping curve to fit a wider range of riding scenarios. This allows the bike to feel more connected to the road while still allowing good bump compliancy. The main body of the unit is an accumulative pressure vessel allowing built up pressure to also alter the damping characteristics when ridding on rough roads/off-road. 

Conventional emulators also require modification of the damper rod generally to yield good result. this is because they don't have a way to also alter the rebound fluid flow within the fork. Because of the added compression dampening, it also because important to add more rebound dampening so conventional emulators require a thicker oil to give more authority to the rebound circuit. Problem with this approach is that it means you also have thick oil running through the stock compression dampening holes leading to super harsh high speed bumps (high fork speed not vehicle speed). 

I found a way around this problem by actually reaching down into the fork's stock components and adding a variable valve to limit rebound flow rate. This means you can use stock fluid and don't need to modify the bikes fork in any way to get a high level of performance. 

I also know that there are lots of different riding style and sizes of people so the Prime Series was made with customization in mind. The unit features, a high speed, low speed, Hi/low bias, and rebound flow adjustments. Users can choose what preset the part ships in, but have the ability to alter it later on.

The Prime Series is backed by a 3 year warranty so if you were to have any issues a new pair would be sent out immediately. I stand behind my product and know it's a game changer but as stated by Subito I will acknowledge Im clueless and accept that I will learn along the way. This is a unique product offering something no other company has managed to do so there has been innovation along every step of the processes. I am always learning and perpetually keeping myself in the mindset of a student. I appreciate the feedback on the product and look forward to reading more. 

[pepperona]

Seems like a cool product for the price. 

@Impulse.Movement , how long have you tested a unit? Was there any damage or wear after riding lots of miles?

[Impulse.Movement]

20 minutes ago, pepperona said:

Seems like a cool product for the price. 

@Impulse.Movement , how long have you tested a unit? Was there any damage or wear after riding lots of miles?

I have but about 3000 miles on the units currently in my main test bike. I go through revisions pretty quick so I don't have any with a bikes lifetime of miles. My test bikes get thrown around pretty hard as my goal is often to see where the parts limits are. It is subject to bad wheelies, jumps, stoppies, Off-Raod, canyon carving, and me hitting curbs and speed bumps at 60mph. The first 6 months of prototypes did not fair well... but through testing and countless iterations I have finally gotten a stable part. Many people have wondered about how the oil affects the plastic. I have parts submerged in another bike's fork for about 6 months with no noticeable change. Things like paint thinner or acetone could change the plastics makeup, but they do fine in petroleum based oils. The fork of most bikes already have some plastic in them. The one way valve for the rebound stroke is control with a plastic ring that I presume is made of nylon.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Impulse.Movement

[cornerslider]

On 6/5/2023 at 1:24 PM, 7fold said:

I'm not sure if anyone on the forums have experience or has even heard of these things - but I came across them while browsing Reddit one day and it looks interesting. I'm curious to see what other people's takes are on something like this 

Prime Series Emulator – Impulse Movement

 

Install looks dead simple - remove fork cap, pull out the spacer and spring, screw this thing in at the bottom of the spring and put everything back in. It's half the cost of the Traxxion AR-25 kit, but I'm wondering if the results are at all similar.

 

 

It seems like a cool product. That being said, by the time you get proper "straight-rate" fork springs suited for your weight (that run $130-$150), you are close to what the Traxxion Dynamics kit runs (that includes the proper fork springs).  The OEM fork springs are a "progressive" spring rate. This style of spring is suited for a broad range of rider weights. This is why manufactures use this kind of spring- It's kind of a "catch-all" spring, but doesn't do anything WELL- but does okay with the masses. I've used the Racetech emulators & springs in the past. They build a decent product that is kind of "generic", and requires modifications to fork components, as well as a "link/code" to access the recommended perimeters for how to set them up. It's kind of envolved, and awkward....

I eventually went with the Traxxion Dynamics AR-25 kit. This is a much better product than Racetech.... They do all the "magic/pixie-dust stuff", based on your specific needs. It comes in a kit with EVERYTHING you need- proper springs, oil, and valving for your specific wants/needs. Drop it in, and enjoy-

I eventually went on to get my race license on this set-up. This kit will get you 99% of what a full cartridge kit will get you. Most people (myself included), don't really know how to properly set-up a cartridge kit front end. Traxxion Dynamics does all the leg-work for you.

All that being said, for most street applications- I think the Impulse Movement product is a good fit. Just don't necessarily expect a huge improvement over OEM dampening & progressive springs.... I hope that helps anyone reading this-

[Impulse.Movement]

20 minutes ago, cornerslider said:

It seems like a cool product. That being said, by the time you get proper "straight-rate" fork springs suited for your weight (that run $130-$150), you are close to what the Traxxion Dynamics kit runs (that includes the proper fork springs).  The OEM fork springs are a "progressive" spring rate. This style of spring is suited for a broad range of rider weights. This is why manufactures use this kind of spring- It's kind of a "catch-all" spring, but doesn't do anything WELL- but does okay with the masses. I've used the Racetech emulators & springs in the past. They build a decent product that is kind of "generic", and requires modifications to fork components, as well as a "link/code" to access the recommended perimeters for how to set them up. It's kind out envolved, and awkward....

I eventually went with the Traxxion Dynamics AR-25 kit. This is a much better product than Racetech.... They do all the "magic/pixie-dust stuff", based on your specific needs. It comes in a kit with EVERYTHING you need- proper springs, oil, and valving for your specific wants/needs. Drop it in, and enjoy-

I eventually went on to get my race license on this set-up. This kit will get you 99% of what a full cartridge kit will get you. Most people (myself included), don't really know how to properly set-up a cartridge kit front end. Traxxion Dynamics does all the leg-work for you.

All that being said, for most street applications- I think the Impulse Movement product is a good fit. Just don't necessarily expect a huge improvement over OEM dampening & progressive springs.... I hope that helps anyone reading this-

I haven't played around with non stock springs on any of the bikes that are being tested as of yet. What I have done is raise the effective spring rate by adding extra oil to the fork creating a high pressure zone of air at the top of the fork. This did not yield better results for me as the Prime Emulators already creates enough force to prevent the fork from bottoming out. The additional springiness of the air usually held the front end too high for corner entry and made the bike harder to steer in. 

The product launched just last month so there are only a handful of people ridding with it. There will be more videos of riders showcasing what the product can do soon but for now here is a fork being tested on a rig. 

Wheel dropping on fork leg on test rig

It shows the stock fork vs fork with prime series installed. A 90lbs wheel is then dropped 4 ft onto the test rig to simulate dropping the front end of a bike down. 

the stock fork give almost no support until it runs into the hydro lock section at the last couple mm of travel. You can see the tire bulging as it bottoms out on the fork. The recoil of the impact sends the wheel up with enough force to briefly leave the test. you may then notice the wheel continues to oscillate for an additional 3 bounces.

The upgraded fork is able to create enough damping force to have a constant amount of pressure all the way to the end of the forks range of travel. the wheel does not bounce off the rig nor does it continue to oscillate. 

[7fold]

This is really great info. Suspension stuff is pretty much a mystery to me (I kind of know basics like what to look for with preload and rebound dampening, but that's about it), but reading these comments about how some of these solutions work is really helpful. 

Also, thanks for joining the forum Impulse.Movement! I wasn't expecting the actual creator to come and join after I made the thread haha.

[Subito]

Just an FYI, the correct term is “damping” not “dampening.”

 

[klx678]

1 hour ago, Subito said:

Just an FYI, the correct term is “damping” not “dampening.”

 

If you check on it you will find both are acceptable terms.  I did so when someone pointed out the same thing when I "corrected" someone else in the same situation as you.  According to Merriam Webster:

damp   verb

damped; damping; damps

transitive verb

1 a : to affect with or as if with a noxious gas : CHOKE

   b : to diminish the activity or intensity of damping down the causes of inflation liquid damps out compass oscillations

  c : to check the vibration or oscillation of (something, such as a string or a voltage

2: DAMPEN  intransitive verb  : to diminish progressively in vibration or oscillation

 

The verb Dampen is listed as a synonym for the verb Damp

Edited June 7, 2023 by klx678

[Impulse.Movement]

5 hours ago, 7fold said:

This is really great info. Suspension stuff is pretty much a mystery to me (I kind of know basics like what to look for with preload and rebound dampening, but that's about it), but reading these comments about how some of these solutions work is really helpful. 

Also, thanks for joining the forum Impulse.Movement! I wasn't expecting the actual creator to come and join after I made the thread haha.

There are a lot of opinions out there, and after filtering through the noise you will find that many aspects of suspension are subjective. However the limitations of a fork with non variable constriction damper vs. one that can change is not even an debate. Any options that switch away from using the stock damper rod alone will be a significant improvement. 

I value every comment and critique. To build the best product for the people, I need to listen to the people. 

 

[Voz Spoz]

I like the theory and the range of adjustments but it feels a little like being a guinea pig with a very new product. I would be happy to give it a go if the early adopter price was a lot lower and that the manufacturer makes a commitment to supply the newer upgraded product as a free or at a very low cost as the product evolves over the next year or so. USD $270 even with a 25% discount until the end of June is not really enticing enough for me to give it a shot at this early stage. I think US$100 would be fair along with a commitment to replace the unit with the new upgraded unit as it evolves.

[Impulse.Movement]

2 hours ago, Voz Spoz said:

I like the theory and the range of adjustments but it feels a little like being a guinea pig with a very new product. I would be happy to give it a go if the early adopter price was a lot lower and that the manufacturer makes a commitment to supply the newer upgraded product as a free or at a very low cost as the product evolves over the next year or so. USD $270 even with a 25% discount until the end of June is not really enticing enough for me to give it a shot at this early stage. I think US$100 would be fair along with a commitment to replace the unit with the new upgraded unit as it evolves.

That’s a very honest opinion sir. I have actually been playing with the idea of a 2 year upgrade plan that would let you update to any new revisions each year. Currently the parts are backed with a 3 year warranty. If there’s any loss in performance or failure, a new set would be shipped out. I will ask for photos documenting the damage for RnD to send out a new set with any revisions if needed. There will be lots of data coming in from my partnered riders who have been testing the product over the past 6 months. The results will will speak for themselves as more individuals are ridding with the system. 

Edited June 17, 2023 by Impulse.Movement

[7fold]

Just bringing this thread back for a quick update (with hopefully another update whenever I'm able to take the bike out and ride it - been raining here pretty much every day for the past week). 

Full disclosure - @Impulse.Movement was kind enough to send me a set of his emulators to install and provide some feedback, so I'll post some initial impressions and then hopefully update them after I'm actually able to ride.

The units themselves are really cleverly designed to allow access to the adjustments and there are quite a few adjustments you're able to make. There's both high speed and low speed compression damping adjustment screws, a hi/low compression damping bias screw, and a rebound adjustment collar that can be set to fully open, fully closed and anywhere in-between (using some clever markings on the bottom that let you know where it's currently adjusted).

Install was simple, I used a head stand to lift the front up, took off the dash, unbolted and moved the handlebars, removed the fork caps, pulled out the spacer, washer and fork spring (with a handy little hook tool that came with the emulators), screwed the units into the bottom of the fork springs and reassembled everything in reverse order. 

Unfortunately, we're getting hit with a tropical storm at the moment, so actual riding impressions will have to wait, but just hopping up and down on the bike in the garage and rolling it forward and squeezing the brakes feel completely different. The '18s and up have an OEM rear shock with both preload and rebound that I adjusted a while back and with the emulators installed, the front forks feel just as composed as the rear does. I'm feeling about a bounce and a half before the bike settles down vs the rear settling in the past and the front feeling like a pogo stick. 

This is all with all of the adjustments set to the middle of the road sport settings, so there's plenty of room to go softer or harder, but I'll wait to actually ride before I make any adjustments since the bike feels really balanced front to rear just messing around with it in the garage. 

@Impulse.Movement has been more than helpful going back and forth via direct messages answering all of the questions I had. He definitely seems to know his stuff, so if anyone is on the fence or just has some questions, I'm sure he'll 100% be able to help out.

I'll definitely come back with some more riding impressions as soon as the weather clears up a bit. 

[7fold]

It's been a few days, but I was finally able to get the bike out for a quick spin after work last night before some more storms potentially roll in today and all I can say is...wow.

I'll start off with saying that I immediately felt a huge difference just pulling out of the driveway and coming up to the stop sign right around the corner. When coming to a stop now, even a slow stop, there is noticeably less dive and I'm not bouncing back and forth like I used to. 

The other thing I immediately noticed is how much easier it feels to flick the bike back and forth. Simply adjusting my weight in the seat has the bike falling in that direction and staying there until I either move my weight back or touch the handlebars. 

Probably the most significant improvement I noticed is when hitting bumps or imperfections in the road with the bike leaned over. Whenever I was taking a corner with any sort of lean, hitting bump would give me this wallowy, floaty feeling as the bike bounced around underneath me. I was honestly pretty terrified the first time I felt it on the highway while going over a bit of uneven pavement around a gentle curve. I know I wasn't losing traction, but it really felt like I was at the time. I've since gotten used to it, but now, that feeling is completely gone. I was actually looking for bumps and divots in the roads around me, purposely driving over manhole covers mid corner just to see if I still get that feeling, but it's 100% gone. The bike is so much more composed now and hitting those bumps mid corner doesn't seem to unsettle it at all; it just feels planted. 

I wasn't about to try any high-speed corners in the middle of the night (not trying to smash into a deer), so I found a nice open parking lot to see how really leaning the bike over feels, and again, the only word I can use to describe the feeling is planted. The bike leans and stays leaned until you either move the handlebars or shift your weight. The difference really is remarkable for such a simple mod.

I'm no club racer or street Rossi by any stretch - I started riding on my MT having zero experience with other bikes. Reading and listening to reviews, everyone mentioned how awful the suspension is on these bikes, but I never really paid much mind to that because my MT was all I knew (besides my fiancé's ninja 300, but I've never really ridden it for extended periods of time, always felt too scrunched up on it). Having felt the difference a slight upgrade to just the front forks can make, I'm kind of kicking myself for leaving the bike stock for so long haha.

Time will tell if the parts being 3d printed will have any long-term issues, but as of now, all I can say is if you're on stock fork internals and are looking for a cheaper upgrade option that's dead simple to install, these seem like a solid choice. I don't know if someone who tracks will have the same opinion, but for general street use and occasional spirited riding, these things are awesome so far. 

[Impulse.Movement]

On 7/7/2023 at 11:22 AM, 7fold said:

It's been a few days, but I was finally able to get the bike out for a quick spin after work last night before some more storms potentially roll in today and all I can say is...wow.

I'll start off with saying that I immediately felt a huge difference just pulling out of the driveway and coming up to the stop sign right around the corner. When coming to a stop now, even a slow stop, there is noticeably less dive and I'm not bouncing back and forth like I used to. 

The other thing I immediately noticed is how much easier it feels to flick the bike back and forth. Simply adjusting my weight in the seat has the bike falling in that direction and staying there until I either move my weight back or touch the handlebars. 

Probably the most significant improvement I noticed is when hitting bumps or imperfections in the road with the bike leaned over. Whenever I was taking a corner with any sort of lean, hitting bump would give me this wallowy, floaty feeling as the bike bounced around underneath me. I was honestly pretty terrified the first time I felt it on the highway while going over a bit of uneven pavement around a gentle curve. I know I wasn't losing traction, but it really felt like I was at the time. I've since gotten used to it, but now, that feeling is completely gone. I was actually looking for bumps and divots in the roads around me, purposely driving over manhole covers mid corner just to see if I still get that feeling, but it's 100% gone. The bike is so much more composed now and hitting those bumps mid corner doesn't seem to unsettle it at all; it just feels planted. 

I wasn't about to try any high-speed corners in the middle of the night (not trying to smash into a deer), so I found a nice open parking lot to see how really leaning the bike over feels, and again, the only word I can use to describe the feeling is planted. The bike leans and stays leaned until you either move the handlebars or shift your weight. The difference really is remarkable for such a simple mod.

I'm no club racer or street Rossi by any stretch - I started riding on my MT having zero experience with other bikes. Reading and listening to reviews, everyone mentioned how awful the suspension is on these bikes, but I never really paid much mind to that because my MT was all I knew (besides my fiancé's ninja 300, but I've never really ridden it for extended periods of time, always felt too scrunched up on it). Having felt the difference a slight upgrade to just the front forks can make, I'm kind of kicking myself for leaving the bike stock for so long haha.

Time will tell if the parts being 3d printed will have any long-term issues, but as of now, all I can say is if you're on stock fork internals and are looking for a cheaper upgrade option that's dead simple to install, these seem like a solid choice. I don't know if someone who tracks will have the same opinion, but for general street use and occasional spirited riding, these things are awesome so far. 

I will be curious to know when you take the bike out to places you have been in the past, how it feels in contrast to how it was Pre-Prime Emulators. I know I found myself revisiting old spots with a new sense of control as I had more feedback from the frontend to feel when the tire was at its grip threshold. My first low side accident Happened after I had been riding for a couple years and was trying to find the limits of breaking and turning in. I had always been fighting that lofty feeling in the front end and just like 7fold I thought it was just part of ridding all motorcycles. I went 8 years of riding daily before I sat on a bike with decent suspension and it changed my whole style of ridding. I went from fighting to keep the bike on the road, to fighting to hold on as the bike launches into corners. 

The shape of a forks damping curve has a significant effect on the available traction to the front end. 

A stock standard style fork has limited traction available until the reactive force of the spring and damper equalizes with the force of the bikes front end pushing into the ground. The soft springs in the FZ07 don't have the spring constant to resist the force imparted due to braking and will often compress all the way down to the hydraulic lock section in the last 10mm or so of suspension travel. This will give you a floating feeling over the road that suddenly becomes a harsh hit with a spike in traction. 

The Prime Series changes the shape of the damper curve, keeping the peak rate of damping similar to that of stock but significantly raising the area under the curve for the initial ramp up of damping. 

This is macro explanation of what give the prime series such dramatic change in handling. 

Superfastmat just released a video talking about dampers and their curves that does a great job laying out the fundamentals 

 

I really appreciate all the feedback you have already given with you experience and hope to read more as you rediscover what you bike can do

[7fold]

I actually did just that haha. Had to head in to one of the hospitals I cover about an hour away late last night and decided to take the bike. The roads are a pretty good mix of everything from smooth freshly paved highway to absolute garbage inner-city roads filled with potholes, speed bumps and manhole covers. 

I have to say, the bike feels completely transformed. I don't normally drive like a madman on the highway, but will say that I hit triple digits for a bit and the bike felt so much more stable than it did on the stock fork internals. Up around 90 on the stock forks, the front end felt very numb and floaty, which was pretty terrifying and part of the reason I never went crazy even on long straight stretches of highway. Even at triple digit speeds with the emulators, the bike felt planted. The front felt incredibly stable and I had that itch to keep pushing it, but decided to slow down and take it easy since it was so late and I didn't want to out ride my headlights.

Once I got to the actual city, I made it a point to just ride over the road imperfections normally (vs. trying to avoid them if I could or standing on the bike if there's really no way around) and again, the bike feels great. The front forks are definitely stiffened up, so I feel the bumps more than I used to, but the big difference is how quickly the bike settles. I'm not bouncing all over the place, rather, I feel the bump, and the bike just shrugs it off and keeps going. Trying to avoid some of the larger potholes (like the ones that bend wheels or cause tire blowouts if you hit them too hard), the bike is now effortless to flick back and forth - I can literally just drop my hips to one side and the bike falls over. I move my hips over to the other side, the bike stands up and falls to the opposite side.

It feels great to have that extra feedback from the front end I never knew was missing until I actually had it. Time will tell if the emulators hold up, but I really hope they do because the improvement is worlds better than stock.

[Lone Wolf]

That is awesome that the suspension is improved with the emulators.

3 minutes ago, 7fold said:

...the bike is now effortless to flick back and forth - I can literally just drop my hips to one side and the bike falls over. I move my hips over to the other side, the bike stands up and falls to the opposite side.

Unless you are doing that on a bumpy road, or during heavy braking - I don't see how emulators would have any effect on ease of turn in.  I believe that is more the result of rake angle (for example dropping the stock forks in triple clamps would steepen the rake and result in less effort to "flick back and forth".

Tire profile can also have an effect (V shape vs rounded profile). 

I could be wrong, but it sounds like the honeymoon effect. I am sure it helped the pogo stick in bumps.

[Impulse.Movement]

4 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

That is awesome that the suspension is improved with the emulators.

Unless you are doing that on a bumpy road, or during heavy braking - I don't see how emulators would have any effect on ease of turn in.  I believe that is more the result of rake angle (for example dropping the stock forks in triple clamps would steepen the rake and result in less effort to "flick back and forth".

Tire profile can also have an effect (V shape vs rounded profile). 

I could be wrong, but it sounds like the honeymoon effect. I am sure it helped the pogo stick in bumps.

The emulators help turn in because they are actively pushing the tire into the ground the very moment you give input to the handle bars. when a bike turns the suspension loads up because its then holding the weight of the bike plus the extra force of changing direction. Another way to think about it is the bike experiences 1g when upright but can have additional lateral force of up to 1g when cornering at 45º 

some simple math a²+b²=c² or (1^2 + 1^2  = x^2 ) shows us that cornering can reach 1.4g of acceleration into the forks. 

Changing the rake of the bike does have an effect on turn in however thats not what is making the big difference here. The emulators do change the preload of the bike lifting the front up about 12mm but that lengthens the trail of the bikes geometry. A longer trail tends to lead to more stability and less agility and thats not the feeling being expressed by 7fold. 

Without the emulators installed there is a lag time between when you push on the handle bars and when the bikes suspension provides enough force into the ground giving traction to the front wheel. 

Im not advocating @7fold try this, but if he took the emulators out and set them to the fully open state. the bike would go back to feeling like a noodle around corners with a slow response to steering input. You could also try adding 12mm of preload with a PVC pipe or some washers and feel how the bike doesn't like to turn as quickly. 

@7fold something that I have been experimenting with is also changing tire pressure. The tire is actually the first element of a suspension system but it has very little damping. I have found that if the tire pressure is too low, it doesn't allow the fork to do the job of absorbing the recoil. Instead of the force from a bump being damped via the fork tube, it is reflected back due to the bouncy nature of tire. 

This sounds super counter intuitive but I actually have gotten a smoother ride putting more air in my tire. 

anything under about 30 psi resulted in a undulating ride where the tire was continuously going from squished state to unladen. I brought the pressure up to 38psi and I did feel the lines in the road more, but the bouncy nature of the tire subsided.

I am continuously testing different variables with the setup so if there are any recommendations or Ideas to try I am open to experimenting with them. 

 

 

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by Impulse.Movement

[7fold]

All valid points, for sure. Maybe the easier side to side movement was from my empty fuel tank, as well, but even my first ride out with the emulators with a somewhat full tank still had that same ease of movement back and forth. Maybe last night it just felt more noticeable since I was riding around with 1 bar left (that turned into the blinking bar on my way home...not fun trying to find an open gas station at 2am, but that's a different story haha).

I noticed tire pressure makes a difference in how the bike feels - I haven't experimented with higher pressures (I just fill them to the manual's recommended 33 front and 36 rear), but I can definitely feel when the tires are lower than that since the bike feels much more sluggish when trying to flick it back and forth. I can check my pressures before my next ride and maybe bump it up a few psi to see if there's any additional difference, though, since I've seen a lot of people here running a bit higher pressures than what the manual recommends.